Speaker 1:
Welcome to the IAP, the Interactive Accessibility Podcast, bringing you the people, technology, and ideas helping to make your world accessible to everyone.

Mark Miller:
Hey, welcome to the IAP Interactive Accessibility Podcast brought to you by the Paciello Group and its affiliate Interactive Accessibility. I am your host Mark Miller thanking you for helping us keep it accessible. Do us a favor. If you're enjoying the IAP, share it. Tell someone about it. Hey, even link to it from your accessible website.
Thanks everybody for joining us. I'm really happy to introduce, first of all, the return of Todd Waites who's back for this podcast. Welcome back, Todd. Thank you for co-hosting with me. Really nice to have you here.

Todd Waites:
Thanks for having me. Thank you.

Mark Miller:
Great. And I want to take no more time here and introduce our guest Sha Yao who is coming to us because she has invented something. And this came out of, I think, a need that was observed, one because of a relationship with her grandmother who had Alzheimer's, and also work with adults, adult care, right? Who needed your care.
And so Sha, you've really come up with a way for people with cognitive disabilities that might have a challenge around sort of feeding themselves a better way to do that through some dishware. I don't know how you would say it, but it's it's cups, spoons, a tray, all this different stuff. I'll let you explain it, that does this great job of sort of returning independence to people. Can you tell us a little bit about what it is and then I'd love to get into your mind a little bit and find out how in the world you actually came up with this.

Sha Yao:
Yes. Hi everyone. This is Sha and I'm the founder and chief designer of Sha Design. And the reason why I thank you so much for having me here and I can talk about the product I come up with. This is originally designed for my grandmother who had dementia. So during the time my family as the main caregivers taking care of my grandma, we realized one thing, is after our loved ones are diagnosed, we have no clue what's the best for her and how to take care of her. And the doctor will also only tell you one thing, is they can give you this prescription for some medicine, and that's the only thing you can do. There's no current cure, there is no way to stop it, and everyone could have develop it.
And as a designer background myself, I'm an industrial designer. So I want to show it in my own way to contribute it to my family and also try to help my grandmother to have better quality of life. And also another important thing is to try to alleviate caring burdens from my mom and my uncle. So I started this idea, not only focusing on the feeding problems, because if you are associated was dementia, you will probably know that caregivers will need 24 hours support because they have so much work to do to assist the person with dementia.
So in the very beginning, I didn't focus on the feeding, but I want to analyze it. What has the most potential? What can be used the most during a day? So I volunteer in the adult daycare center as a first staff, and I tried to work with the professional caregivers and to observe what kind of problems a person may have during the whole day. And also I work with the professional caregivers and see what kind of treatment or what kind of what's the best way for the caregivers themselves to take care of a person with dementia.
So that's when I realized there are so many things I can do. For example, one of the problem is they may wandering off in the street. One category is what I'm trying to do is to try to improve the daily activity. And another direction is to how can I improve the interaction between them and ourselves. So I focus on daily activity, and I think I realized that eating is one of the main issues they may have. For most of the people with dementia, they may have less appetite and their physical strength and cognitive impairment may cause them to eat less than they should. And the caregivers will have to assist them to eat or feed them at least twice a day. So that's why I think, oh, this has the most potential to develop. And also when I consult with the professional caregivers and also the family caregivers, they told me like, "Yeah, it will be a very good input if I could do something to help on this direction." So that's how I come up with all the ideas and try to invented something to help on this.

Mark Miller:
I see pictures on your website of you and your grandmother. And they look like any granddaughter that loves their grandmother. There's that one where you're sort of embracing her and kissing her. And then I imagine you volunteering in these adult daycares and observing all of this. So there's this like very compassionate, loving mind that's also very analytical, right? Because it's amazing to me. Hearing you talk you're not just saying like, "Oh, I saw they were having a hard time eating. I decided to try and fix that." You're saying, "I was looking at everything and eating seemed to be the thing, the place where I could make the most impact."

Sha Yao:
Right.

Mark Miller:
It's like in our business, Todd, when we're working with a client we're prioritizing issues and stuff like that on their website for accessibility, one of the big things we do is we show them where can you make the most impact in the shortest amount of time. And you really approached this situation the same way.
And then I looked at some of these things that you've done. There was amazing things to me. Like one, I'd love to hear you talk about color and the research around color, and how that stimulates people who are not eating enough because of these challenges to eat more. And some of the physical design features, I was looking at some of the physical design features like how you have contoured the spoon to match the bowl, thinking, Oh man, I want that. I struggle with getting the bowl... Can I get one of these for myself? It would make my life easier.
So talk to me a little bit about how you... You obviously didn't just sort of make it up. There was a process here by which you really dove in. You figured out things like the color, you put some thought behind it to the point and did research to the point where you came up with these amazing ideas, like the contoured spoon. Talk to me a little bit about that process for you and how you went from, I love my grandmother and these people that I'm volunteering for at adult daycares to this very well thought out sort of engineering result, product.

Sha Yao:
Yeah. So if you ever, if people ever have a chance to go on my website, I don't know if I can say it here or-

Mark Miller:
Yeah you can say your website. And we'll actually link to it as well from the show. So if you don't have a [crosstalk 00:08:11] link for it, we'll link to it.

Sha Yao:
So the website it's eatwellset.com E-A-T-W-E-L-L-S-E-T.com. So if you ever come over to see, to check the website and you will see a very colorful picture of the product itself. And so for most of the people, the first impression for the product is it's very colorful. And it's not because I like color, it's because it's a research back up all the features.
So obviously the color is one of the most significant feature, which is based on the research conducted by Boston University, which States that if a person switched the white plate to a solid color one, a person with dementia can consume 24% more food and 84% more liquid. And that research had been done a long time ago. And when I first did my research, and when I found that report, I was shocked. I was like, oh my God, there is a great paper state that clearly, but no one really apply it to the real product and to be used in the real world.
And that's the timing one I decided that I want to, I want to apply that to all the products they use. And also based on that, I also come up with more features all similar to this, but all applied to the whole set to help people to eat better. For example, the features that you just mentioned, that it is, I made the bowl slanted, so all the food or the soup will be gathering on one side without scrubbing by themself.
And that's all based on the one-on-one observations when I volunteer in the adult daycare centers. And so I have... I think I volunteered and in the adult daycare centers for almost one year, so I have the privilege to serve them and also watch them to observe what's the struggle they may have. For example, they may confuse the patterns on the plate. If there is a leaf patterns and they may think it's the food, they're always scooping constantly. So that's also another reason why, if you see my design, there's no patterns on it because it might confused them.
And also I made the bowls slanted, and also the curvature in their wall of the bowl can be totally matched a curvature of the spoon head. That's also because when I was observing grandma to eat and I saw her try so hard to use this spoon, to scoop a food and try to come close to her mouth. And when she scoop the food, it's not that easy for her to push the food into the spoon. It's so easy for everyone that we... We all know that eye, hand coordination thing is like, oh, I want this food in my spoon, so I just scoop. But for them, they can't do a certain physical movement that they are not able to figure out the relationship between the food, and hand, and the spoon.
So what I'm trying to do is I want to make every process of eating as easy as possible. So that's why I'm thinking, okay so why not I just make the curvature match? I match the curvature of the plate, the spoon, and the bowl. So when they scoop the food, that can be so easy for them to get to whatever they can. And they can easily, they can get a smoother scroop. Yeah.
And also there is, if you are able, if you check the cups we have, both of the cups I designed are anti-tipping because people with dementia may have said that's perception problem, which means it's almost like if you close one of your eyes and try to grab something in front of you, you're not able to get the right distance between yourself and the object in front of you. So they will tend to tip over cups very often. Most of the caregivers don't know that. They will just say, "Hey, grandma, why you tip over the cups again and again?" And the water spill out and they got frustrated, and themselves got frustrated too.
So what I'm trying to do as I revise the existing mug , and I extended the handle of the mug to the tabletop for added support, so when they hold the cups, it can be in anti-tipping. And also another cup, there is a rubber mat material on the bottom design as the cup holder, so it won't tip over that easily. So it actually helps them to finish the water and feel less frustrated. And also I might talk too much. It's just very-

Mark Miller:
You're great, keep going.

Sha Yao:
And another feature is I realized that when I use the straw, when I put the straw in the cup and people with dementia sometimes yeah they will try to move their heads to look for the straw and they're not able to catch it. That's something very tiny thing to not able to be discovered or solved by the caregivers themselves. Sometimes they just got frustrated. So I design a cup lid which can work with the cup. And also, it's a little bit hard to describe, but the straw, there is a hole for the straw. The lid will hold the straw in place and also goes to the lower part of the cup, because the cup is also slanted inside, so it helps them to finish the liquid. Yeah. So there are... I usually won't talk about that much detail, because there are more than 20 of them. But I'm glad that I have the chance to at least talk about a few of them. And if people are interested, they can definitely take a look.

Todd Waites:
What an amazing story and product. I love the story of you, for one thing, having such emotional skin in the game, right? Your grandmother, who you love, and you just, you knew what she once was, and now you know what she's capable of doing, and you didn't want there to be barriers. It's easy to identify a need, it's not so easy to figure out a way around it. And the fact that you decided to be in the trenches with the folks and knowing that maybe you didn't know the whole need and volunteering and being in there with them, and then thinking through, wow, I can really improve this situation, is amazing. And I love what you're describing. I actually, I have one arm. And when you were talking about the bowl, yeah. It is tough to just scrape that bottom if it's not off to one side. And so there's a lot of applications that I see here. I'm just very, very impressed. Yeah.

Mark Miller:
Yeah. I was going to ask you about that, Todd, because I was thinking about you and some of the challenges that Sha was describing. Wondering if only having one arm, if it's more difficult to steady a bowl and maybe get after something. Or do you have issues with, I don't know why you would, but even like the stability of the cups and stuff like that?
I feel like we look at accessibility and one of the things that we're always kind of telling people is when you make something more accessible to a wider audience, you tend to improve it for the audience that's already there as well. In all seriousness listening to you talk, thinking like, wow, sitting at my desk right now I've got a cup of coffee and it's not very stable. And if I put it far away from me because I'm worried about knocking it over and not that I'm going to slam into it, but that just a subtle movement's going to knock it all over my keyboard. I really think that maybe you're innovating in a way that's going to even reach beyond its original purpose. But for you, Todd, are there other things that you can think of that would help in your situation?

Todd Waites:
Well, I'll tell you what's funny and it's a running joke because my wife and I, when we go out to eat or when we're sitting at our table and I'm done eating. Her and even our 11 year old, their place is spotless. I'm move my plate and there's food all over, but it's because when you're taking the fork and scraping up the food, you have no way to also kind of hold it onto the plate, so 60% gets on the spoon or the fork and the rest finds its way onto the table. And so I'm something around the edges of a plate, that would be amazing.

Mark Miller:
I can just imagine somebody holding my hand and not letting me like steady the plate or the bowl and how frustrating and irritating that would be. So I imagine it's got to be a challenge for you.
So Sha, did you ever think, I don't know if this is a unique conversation for you or if you've seen this before, but are there, do things bubble up for you where the applications that you intended are just the beginning and you're really seeing ways that this might extend beyond its original intent?

Sha Yao:
Yes, but it was not in my plan. It's also, it's only because after... By the way I ran a crowd funding campaign in 2014. It helps me to fund all the mold, the cast and all the molds, and to really deliver the products into the market. And it's after I delivered the products and I started to receive some emails saying the supporters told me like, "Oh, your product really helps my son who has some physical, constant constraints." And, "Your products, it really helps my mother who just got a stroke early this year." So this is some, the moment that I realized that, oh, I think I designed a product for universal, it's a universal design. Everyone can use it and people who ever can benefit from it are very welcome to take a look and try it. And Todd, you'd probably need to send me your address. I want to send you a kit too, to try it.

Todd Waites:
Oh wow. I'd love that.

Sha Yao:
Yeah.

Todd Waites:
I think my wife would love that too if I had that.

Sha Yao:
Yeah. And even the-

Mark Miller:
You could be responsible for helping Todd's marriage. Can you believe that? You can do that?

Sha Yao:
Yeah. And even the parents give me the feedback like, they want to let their children to try it too. Especially during the time when they're, when they learn self-feeding. So it's another way. But although the size might be revised since they are smaller, but I'm glad that the product can help people with dementia, like my grandmother, and also people with other other need. Yeah.

Todd Waites:
Yeah, amazing.

Mark Miller:
So I'd like to pivot if you guys are okay a little bit here. The other side of this that's really interesting to me, Sha, is that it's one thing to innovate this way and to come up with something, but there's a whole other piece where you actually have to bring it to market. You have to create funds like you were talking about before. You started to touch on it a little bit. Can you talk to me a little bit about what that process was like for you? And I'm imagining it's a little, it was a little more unfamiliar to you than the design part of it, right? So what was that process and what kind of resources did you pull in to really help yourself get it to the point where it is now and the way that it's touching the market now?

Sha Yao:
So after I finished the design, and as a designer, I thought my job is done. I come up with the best design I can ever come up with. Then the next step is I graduated from school and I got the first place. And I thought I will just find a job and also try to figure out how to bring my products to life.

Mark Miller:
When you say, sorry to interrupt, when you say you got first place, you mean you got first place in the 2014 Stanford Design Challenge. Is that what you're talking about?

Sha Yao:
I was also the first place when I graduated in my-

Mark Miller:
Oh, you graduated first in your school?

Sha Yao:
Yeah.

Mark Miller:
Oh, man. So you have first places all over the place.

Sha Yao:
Yeah.

Mark Miller:
Todd, can you relate to that? I can't.

Sha Yao:
But the Stanford awards is actually one of my strategy to bring the products to the market. Because after I finished the design and I was not planning to bring it to the market that soon because I was poor during that time to be honest.

Mark Miller:
Of course, you're a student.

Sha Yao:
Yeah, I didn't have a job. And during that time I was confused. Like I have to figure out what I want to do in the future for my future. And during that time, the only thing I did, I started to do, besides looking for a job, and I come up with the business plan. But that's not for someone else, that's for myself. Because I want to know how much resources I have to put together. And two, how can I really market it? Or what kind of connections, or resources, or money funding I have? Then I realized I don't really have much. But that's the first step.
And my strategy during that time is I know that I definitely need the funding for the manufacturing process, because it's a physical product and that's a lot of money. And also I will need a way to market the product as well.
So my strategy is to find as much as competitions I can, the design competition and I tried to enroll. And most, some of them are free. Like the Stanford one is free. And the way I decided to do this is because I realized that even though I'm very familiar with people work associated with Alzheimer's, like I attended not only volunteering daycare center, but also I contact the Alzheimer's associations and I talked to support groups locally and in other chapters too. But I know all the caregivers, but I don't have any ways to talk to like executive level managers to let them know that I have to this wonderful product and I am trying to get funding.
And so during that time, I'm lucky to won the first place at the Stanford Design Challenge. That's actually a really good turning point for me because I was trying to compact as much as possible, like all the professional in that field.

Mark Miller:
Right.

Sha Yao:
But when I cold email people, they probably won't reply. Yeah.

Mark Miller:
You don't say.

Sha Yao:
Yeah, I was very excited. I still remember how it feels like when I passed the first round competition and finally I can presented my work in front of 200, more than 200 experts at Stanford. And one of the judges, even as one of the person I tried to contact, and I email her several times about but never got responded. And I was so excited. I was like, oh my God, this is my lifetime chance. I have to present it well. So that's my turning point.
I like the product to be seen by important people in this field. And also after that, I decided to run my crowd funding campaign. And it's not that easy for me during that time because I'm a designer only. I don't really know much about it, but I did my homework. I searched online and connect with crowd funding campaign teams. Then I asked my friends and families to help me to take great photos. And I designed a website by myself and I also come with the price levels and discuss with my friends. And I also, I went to design school, so I also look for my roommates to help me to film the videos. And I think I came with three times as a draft. Then I also is part of my rent to hire someone professional to really present the products in a video. Yeah it's all comes together. And I ran a crowd funding campaign and raised 100,000 during that time.

Todd Waites:
We need to get you into Shark Tank, the show Shark Tank.

Sha Yao:
Yeah, many people mentioned that to me. Yeah but I think they'll probably focus more on the profit part.

Todd Waites:
Right.

Sha Yao:
I have to have some numbers for them before I'll go.

Mark Miller:
So Sha, is this the only thing that you're doing right now? Are you working another job or has this gotten to a point where it's taking your full-time attention?

Sha Yao:
It's a very good question, actually. I also work for other companies too. I wear several hats at the same time. And another thing I'm working on is about the VR virtual reality content.

Mark Miller:
Wow. Very cool. So is your ultimate goal to be doing nothing but Eat Well? Or do you think this will always kind of stay as a passion project for you?

Sha Yao:
It's a really tricky situation for me, actually. I really enjoy designing something can help people to have better quality of life. And for me it's always like soon as I can come up good designs and really make it into the market, I'm willing to give it a try and just do it. But for the second generation of the products, I really want to focus more on other directions besides eating.
But as what I mentioned that, before I really focused, devoted myself to a project, I actually need a long time to prepare for it and to did all the research I can. And I have to be... I want myself to be a [inaudible 00:28:42] of the experts in that field to really answer any questions people may ask me. And I want to... Sorry. I want to make sure that every step is solid and I don't want to just draw something and design it and just... Yeah, I want to fit the need. Yeah. So it's maybe a longer process. So during that time I may work on something else, but I will always, and I know I will still develop something more in the future.

Mark Miller:
Well, that sounds wonderful. We need to wrap up. Our time's coming to an end, but I feel like I could talk to you forever.

Sha Yao:
[inaudible 00:29:30] .

Mark Miller:
It's really an interesting case of you seeing a need and solving it. And then you end up, I think it happens to everybody, right? Everybody's got a skill set and it leads something. And then all of a sudden they're thrown into the fire where they have to figure out all these other things like how... Like you're, no longer a designer, you're an entrepreneur with a design background and you have to learn how to become an entrepreneur. And it's something that keeps going. So it's very exciting. Obviously you're at the front end of all this. This is all new to you. You're newly out of school and this is all unfolding for you. So that's very, very exciting. I can see someday where Sha Enterprises has multiple products out there for solving all sorts of issues for all sorts of people that need that kind of help.
One of the things that really, that I love about something like this that you've created, is there's a lot of practical things that it improves for people. I can get the food onto my spoon, I can get it into my mouth. But really what, at the end of the day what it's providing is, it's providing independence and dignity for people who are starting to lose it. And that sometimes, I think, is the most important aspect of all this. And when you don't have those type of issues, you don't stop to think about how important that might be to somebody. You see a person in a wheelchair or a person who is struggling with something and you think, ah, whatever, that's their lot in life and you move on. But really they're struggling to find their dignity where they may have felt like they've lost it. And this kind of thing is just one thing in their day that brings up back a little bit for them. So I think that that's wonderful. And I think you've got a great product.
Anything to add, Todd, before we wrap up?

Todd Waites:
That lack of dignity also plays into quality of life. You start to see people give up, and I think you're giving new hope. I think it's amazing.

Mark Miller:
Yeah. Well, and Todd, for you, I think in your story and what happened with your arm, there was a little bit of that. You had a little bit of that struggle, too, in your background, so you probably really understand and appreciate that.

Todd Waites:
Yeah, absolutely.

Mark Miller:
Yeah. Great. All right. Well listen, really appreciate it again, Sha. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Todd, I want to see your face here more often. It's really great having you on board with this and helping me out here so I'm not all by myself. So thank you so much for being on today. And this is Mark Miller thanking Sha, Todd, our producer Marissa and reminding you all to keep it accessible.

Speaker 1:
The IAP interactive accessibility podcast is brought to you by Interactive Accessibility the accessibility experts. You can find their access matters blog at interactiveaccessibility.com/blog.